Autism and Psoriasis

** Originally posted by gracejc **

Recently, I've been hearing more and more about the increased risk of mothers with psoriasis giving birth to children, who are later diagnosed with some form of autism. It's all terribly frightening. I have a 2.5 yr. old son who is healthy and well-adjusted, but it certainly makes me afraid for future children.

Any thoughts, additional information would be most welcomed.

Much thanks.

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** Originally posted by AnnieB **

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/19829.php

"However, Croen said that the overall risk of a woman with allergies, asthma or psoriasis giving birth to a child who goes on to develop autism is low. Approximately 1% of children born to women with such disorders develop an autism spectrum disorder, according to the Tribune. Croen warned that the study's findings have not yet been replicated..."

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** Originally posted by twinieten **

This is certainly scarry! I have to wonder, though, how much it has to do with the fact that autism is more and more common these days. It used to be something like 1 in every 10K children were autistic, and now it's one in 150, or something like that. Three out of four being boys. How much of it has to do with better diagnosis, and how much of it has to do with environment?

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** Originally posted by anaxarete **

and how much of it has to do with environment?

Id love to see (or for sometone to do) a study on the comparison on the number of children in city areas with autism as opposed to country areas.
Autism is constantly on Current Affairs programs, at least once a week theres something about parents stuggling with an autistic child and one thing ive noticed is that these kids are only ever city kids, I want to know if thats just because city people are more likely to participate in these shows or because there arent as many living out in the country...

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** Originally posted by twinieten **

Well, I could guess that some "country folk" might end up moving to the city because that's where the services are. Then, of course, there more autistic people in these areas just becuase the population in cities is more dense, increasing the odds. I read an article where autism is more prevalent in certain areas, that's becuase you have the functioning autistic, people with a much milder form of autism, meeting, marrying and having children with others like them. I do wonder, like you, if just the location of the city itself can play a part, and factors of pollution, etc. can play a part. I beleive there are other factors too, including vaccinations, but that's an issue for another forum. ;)

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** Originally posted by AnnieB **

Also people are putting off having kids and older parents have a greater risk of having an autistic child. I hope the picture becomes more clear. There are so many theories about what factors are contributing to this rise. I know a lot of parents who are dealing with this!

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** Originally posted by annniee **

My mother has psoriasis .. I have 5 brothers and sisters and no signs of autism

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** Originally posted by twinieten **

Good to know annniee!

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** Originally posted by boundaryseeker **

Recently, I've been hearing more and more about the increased risk of mothers with psoriasis giving birth to children, who are later diagnosed with some form of autism. It's all terribly frightening.
Any thoughts, additional information would be most welcomed.
Much thanks.

The thing about genetics, and the studies into inheritance, is that it takes so long; it literally takes generations of time for things to come to the surface or manifest themselves.

This thread got my attention in a BIG way. I have been researching this very thing... the connections, if any, between autistic spectrum disorders & attention deficit disorders and auto-immune diseases such as P, PA & Fibro.

I am no professor, but I think I am qualified to some degree about these.

My mother has had P most of her life since her teens. She also has an autistic spectrum disorder, not formally diagnosed, as well as anxiety and dependency issues. I also suspect SPD (sensory processing disorder). Her mother had arthritis and chronic fatigue.
My younger brother has an autistic spectrum disorder. He shows no sign of P or PA, he has had his struggles but is talented and hardworking.
I have had P since I was 20. 2yrs ago I was officially diagnosed with P, PA & Fibro and most recently SPD (possibly potentiated by all the flares).
Just on 4 years ago my daughter, now 15, was officially diagnosed with Aspergers (autistic spectrum disorder) and SPD. She is also talented and diligent with her work. And yesterday morning said daughter asks me "What are these marks on my leg?" It looked a lot like P to me.
I also have another pre-teen daughter who is doing just fine, currently has no auto-immune or autistic indicators, and is very compassionate and understanding to the others in her family who have these daily challenges to deal with.
All this has taught me, and others in my family, a great deal.
We are who we are.
Hmmmmmm....as to what the connection is...you decide.
Feel free to PM me.
Let me know, what are your thoughts?

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** Originally posted by aysha01 **

I think it is more connected to the fact that both conditions are autoimmune related..my daughter is on the autism spectrum (age 3), and I got dx with psoriasis 3 months ago.

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** Originally posted by taweavmo4 **

I too think it's an auto-immune connection. I have Celiac (which is auto immune), but no psoriasis on my side of the family or dh's. We have three Celiac kids, one of which had many red flags for autism and rec'd therapy but was never formally dx'd. Then there's my 8 year old who developed P early on at the age of 3. We have auto-immune disorders all over the place!

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** Originally posted by teenPA18 **

I don't think there's any connection between autism and psoriasis.

Psoriasis has been in my family for many years (ofc - since its genetic).
I don't have any one in my immediate, distance or any other known family to me, to have autism.

Its just probable that some people with the psoriasis defect have the autism defect too. But they have no connection.

Anyway, I think its also important to note that in effect, we all have autism. There is just different levels of autism that someone can have. There was an article on this somewhere, I can't find it. Still, some people with autism do amazing things.

.
One guy can play music on a piano just by listening to the song - he can't read music, he can't interact with people fully. Yet somehow he can do this.

Another guy can draw amazingly accurate pictures of complex buildings, hours after viewing the building. He also can't interact fully and has learning difficulties.

One more guy, can tell you the day of the week if you give him the date - of any date future or past, faster than you can work it out using a calculator and the formula.

True, not all autistic people have these extraordinary abilities, but they are simply different. I would not say they have a disease; I dont think thats correct.

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** Originally posted by food4u **

The autistic savant you are talking about is brainman(Daniel Tammet).When I first saw this piece on him, http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/01/26/60minutes/main2401846.shtml I was so in awe.It is amazing that his brain can do the things it does.He memorized pi to 22,00 digits! I have always had a sneaking suspicion that the connection between psoriasis,autism,diabetes and autoimmune diseases in general is something in the vaccines they shoot everybody up with as this guy says in this article http://www.whale.to/v/coulter.html Diabetes has gone up 20 times the level it was in the 40's.1 out of 150 kids these days has autism.I hope medical research can figure out what is going on SOON.

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** Originally posted by teenPA18 **

Oh, the psoriasis statics for the world population are 2% i've heard.

For the UK its 20% of the population.

Considering we have free jabs to stuff, mmmm maybe your right.

btw, my statistics might not the right, its what i seem to recall them being.

EDIT:

Wow i just read that article http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007...in2401846.shtml

That is amazing. They need to take DNA samples of that guy and clone him. Think of all the extraordinary things he could do. Send technology far into the future, cure all diseases... wow.

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** Originally posted by topsul **

I also wonder if it has to do with the fact that we take more medications and use more creams. I realize the FDA marks some of these as "safe" for pregnant women, but who really knows?

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** Originally posted by joyousmom **

I'm just lurking here. I think there's more of a connection between autism and vaccinations than autism and psoriasis! Look at what the doctor's are injecting into our kids' vaccines these days. First they are giving tons of more shots than we had as kids. And there is tons of mecury in every shot!

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** Originally posted by joyousmom **

There are not ton's of mercury in every shot, thats untrue. You do not have to have your children vaccinated either, there are ways to get around that, my sister in law has done this against everyones advice...

Karen

I once heard there is no way to remove all the thimerosal. And you are correct about not having to vaccinate my kids (I actual don't). I agree with your sister in law!

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** Originally posted by Ishmay **

One reason the amount of children being diagnosed with autism has increased is because of the autism spectrum scale. Before kids who did not meet enough of the requirements were not considered autistic, now these kids are able to be diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum scale. We learned about this in a psych course I was in last year, I can't remember the specifics about the scale, but I remember my professor telling us this is the reason for the increase in diagnosis. The spectrum scale is less strict, but still accurate.
Also, I don't think there is a relationship between autism and p. My mom has p and pa and I am the only one of my sisters to get p, none of us have autism and non of my moms siblings or their children have autism...and I have large family. I personally would be more worried about my children inheriting p from me than autism.

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** Originally posted by violamom **

I don't think there's any connection between autism and psoriasis.

Psoriasis has been in my family for many years (ofc - since its genetic).
I don't have any one in my immediate, distance or any other known family to me, to have autism.

Its just probable that some people with the psoriasis defect have the autism defect too. But they have no connection.

Anyway, I think its also important to note that in effect, we all have autism. There is just different levels of autism that someone can have. There was an article on this somewhere, I can't find it. Still, some people with autism do amazing things.

.
One guy can play music on a piano just by listening to the song - he can't read music, he can't interact with people fully. Yet somehow he can do this.

Another guy can draw amazingly accurate pictures of complex buildings, hours after viewing the building. He also can't interact fully and has learning difficulties.

One more guy, can tell you the day of the week if you give him the date - of any date future or past, faster than you can work it out using a calculator and the formula.

True, not all autistic people have these extraordinary abilities, but they are simply different. I would not say they have a disease; I dont think thats correct.

It is true that many kids on the spectrum have unique abilities... clearly not as amazing as your examples but still significant. If we look at the people in the past who were on the spectrum we can see that they are the great "outside the box thinkers" who have changed the world.

wikipedia lists the following of people who are suspected to be (or have been) autistic

Writers – Hans Christian Andersen, Lewis Carroll, Bruce Chatwin, Arthur Conan Doyle, Herman Melville, George Orwell, Jonathan Swift and William Butler Yeats.
Philosophers – A.J. Ayer, Baruch de Spinoza, Immanuel Kant and Simone Weil.
Musicians – Bela Bartok, Ludwig van Beethoven, Bob Dylan, Glenn Gould, Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart and Erik Satie.
Painters – Vincent van Gogh, L.S. Lowry, Jack B. Yeats and Andy Warhol.

My son has aspergers syndrome... he is a square peg for sure. Once I got the school to stop trying to shove and medicate him into that round hole he has flourished. He will never be the same as other kids but his symphony is coming along nicely...

All that said, I doubt that autism and p have anything to do with each other. My darling aspie has beautiful skin..

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** Originally posted by crazymomma **

hi; I've not visited the Boards in awhile; after a few years of battling P via topicals, at 15 yrs. of age my son made the decision to use Humira. It has made an amazing difference, and I pray that this continues to be so...and that he can afford the meds when he's older/independent...as he ALSO takes 2 meds for ADD. It's an expensive batch of products. As the psychologist and pediatrician said "the objective is to help him concentrate as much as possible while still within the hallowed halls of learning, because what he learns then can 'stick', but he can't retain what's never installed. So, even if he were without ADD meds later in life, he'd have an education to draw from. The increase from one ADD med to two was something I accepted reluctantly, but the results have been positive. The docs are not All-Knowing, but in partnership w/child and family, advances are made.

my son, besides P, has Aspergers, which was diagnosed in latter part of primary school; prior to that we thought it was all ADD. It was a hard blow to take, for Asperger's is socially challenging and isolating enough!! Kids were generally grossed out by all the redness and severe flaking. He's been in the same school system/community since kindergarten, so there was a bit of understanding and caring, but the two conditions combined were so unfair to a young teen, and he felt very much alone. He'd put on his tux to sing with high school choir, and his lapels would have 'snow' everywhere within moments. I was amazed at how few tears he shed over this; personally, like most of you, I've cried Buckets. It is also quite difficulte to concentrate in class when one is terribly ITCHY.

When I was pregnant with him, in the third trimester I developed a rash on my abdomen that itched like crazy, and hydrocortisone cream that the docs prescribed did nothing to help, and in fact seemed to aggravate it. This was wintertime, and it was torture to have to 'bundle up' against cold weather to go out, when all I wanted to do was strip down and waddle about in a nightgown. The docs just shrugged and said that it would all go away when the baby was delivered, and that's correct. (there's a fancy schmancy medical term for that type rash, but i don't remember it.) I did not experience this with my first child. If I had, I would likely have blamed it upon the tropics (Guam). Boy Child was born in Pacific Northwest in winter.

so, my son was born, and he had a red mark on his forehead that the nurses called an 'angel kiss'; I was told it would go away with time. Again, they were correct. Until it disappeared, though, it would show up most when the weather was cold. It's apparent in all baby and toddler pics.

I have wondered about a possible connection between P and Aspergers/Autism, more from the standpoint that my father-in-law, a sister-in-law, and one niece have P, so that seems to be inherited. FIL cheerily told me "oh yes...way back in ____ Uncle Saul was so depressed he committed suicide over his psoriasis". A factoid I did not share with my son.
In my father's family, we are supposedly kin to Benjamin Franklin, who had Psoriasis.

I just finished reading "Look Me in the Eye by John Elder Robison. His father had depression issues that may have been partially fueled by psoriasis. JER is famously of the Asperger's community. That reinforced my curiosity about possible linkage between Autism and P.

IMO my FIL and my husband have a good many indicators for Aspergers, as did my father, and I wonder a bit about a nephew of mine, but never see him enough to be sure...just some things I picked up from watching a video he made.

as for the abdominal rash that I developed, I now wonder if it was more an 'indicator' of things to come, vs. having a causative effect. There is so much 'exchange' going on between Mom and Baby that his little system may have been giving me grief, vs. the other way around. ;-)

this is not enough to cause me to fear vaccines. I've had polio and it seemingly came from a defective vaccine (either mine, or from changing diapers for my little brother). To me, that just means I lost the 'lottery' of statistics. With time, this Haiti earthquake crisis is going to produce sad statistics in relation to disease, some of which can be thwarted by vaccination. Some diseases have all but disappeared due to vaccination; that is why 'biological warfare' with stuff dispersed thru the air evolved.

we may never know some things concretely, but it's good to ask the questions; sometimes answers come by and by. We're already so much better off than 'Uncle Saul.' ;-)

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** Originally posted by crazymomma **

forgot to mention that all of my kids' medical records (and mine, for that matter!) are held by the US Navy records department. That kind of records system would enable a bit of 'connecting of dots', statistics-wise', because even though that large population involved moves all over the globe, if the parents put in a full career of 20 years or more, you have a record going back that far. 'Longitudinal Studies', I think it's called, if one group of kids is deliberately tracked and specific data gathered in increments over time. To go in and delve deeply in records is more time consuming, but gotta wonder if that kind of thing could turn up nuggets of valuable information.

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