Vitamin K2, MK4

• By doc3
• Reply 3382051
• September 17, 2012 at 8:52 am
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http://supplements.relentlessimprovement.com/categories.aspx?Keyword=k2

• By Nancy08
• Reply 3382203
• September 17, 2012 at 9:47 am
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You can buy cheeper Carlsom Vit K2 MK-4 $16 dollars here is the link http://www.swansonvitamins.com/carlson-vitamin-k2-menatetrenone-5-mg-60-cap s

• By Nancy08
• Reply 3382421
• September 17, 2012 at 10:53 am
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Yes drneustadt, I take Osteo K too and I am very pleased with it, I have been taking it for 6 months but I only take 3 pills a day I hope it works fine because I read here that people who took only 15 mg of K2 MK4- had a good outcome too. The reason I take only 3 a day is cost, I pay 53.00 per bottle for the osteo K, where do I find it for 39.00?

• By lilypads
• Reply 3383041 · In reply to 3382284 by drneustadt
• September 17, 2012 at 1:57 pm
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I just looked at the NBI website and see that one 180-capsule bottle (one month's supply) of Osteo-K costs $55.95. To get 45 mg of MK4, you would need to take 6 capsules a day. That would give you 1000 mg of calcium citrate. In my opinion, that's too much calcium.

I just bought 180 5 mg capsules of Carlson's MK4 at www.vitacost.com for $40.57. Taking 9 a day, that bottle would last 20 days. I only take 3 a day, but I don't have osteoporosis. Daily cost is $2.02.

The Thorne drops can be bought here http://www.iherb.com/Vitamin-K2-1-fl-oz-30-ml/21592?at=0 for $62.40. One bottle will last 26 days if you take 45 drops daily. Daily cost is about $2.35.

According to the book "Vitamin K2 and the Calcium Paradox," tests will soon be available that will let us know if we are getting enough K2. Then we won't be stuck with guesswork or the one-size-fits-all 45-mg daily.

• By lilypads
• Reply 3383060
• September 17, 2012 at 2:02 pm
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I just looked at doc3's link above. Relentless Improvement's MK4 is only $1.17 a day if you buy 4 bottles. Definitely the best buy. I'll be getting mine from them starting now.

By the way, my "daily cost" numbers are all for taking 45 mg. daily.

• By doc3
• Reply 3383282
• September 17, 2012 at 3:22 pm
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It is perhaps worthwhile to note that the Japanese study that is referenced so much was not a dosage study, it was an effectiveness study [1]. There was prior work demonstrating a lack of Vit K2 MK4 toxicity at high dose levels. When you want to assess effectiveness without being burdened by dose/response issues you always go to the highest level that you can. In this case 45 mg per day. There is no evidence that you would fail to get the effect at substantially lower dosage, there just has been no data on which to base a dosage recommendation (above the US Dietary Reference Intake of 120 mcg per day for men and 90 mcg for women). Thus the range of potential effectiveness is between ~100 mcg and 45,000 mcg per day. Even a binary search in this space will take a lot of data and much time to complete the necessary dose/response studies.

[1] a b Sato, Y; Kanoko T, Satoh K, Iwamoto J (2005). "Menatetrenone and vitamin D2 with calcium supplements prevent nonvertebral fracture in elderly women with Alzheimer's disease". Bone 36 (1): 61–8. doi:10.1016/j.bone.2004.09.018. PMID 15664003.

• By lilypads
• Reply 3383375
• September 17, 2012 at 4:01 pm
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Doc3, I see that you are 112 years old. Do you attribute your longevity to Vitamin K2? If so, how much do YOU take?

• By torn2tears
• Reply 3384159
• September 17, 2012 at 9:22 pm
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Hi all,

Peak brand K2 and Relentless brand K2 only provide 12500% of K2 whereas Ulta K2’s 15 mg’s provides 18750%.
Ulta K2 is only 34.97 with Free shipping. Just break the capsule open and you can divide into (approximately) 15 parts which would be about one MILLIgrams a piece. I keep mine on top of a clean envelope inside a top drawer as light can reduce potency.

Most people will only need 1 to two MILLIgrams three times a day of K2 –mk4 with a teaspoon of coconut oil or olive oil.

Drugstore.com has the Healthy Origins 10000 Iu’s of D3 for 19.99. So if you get a total purchase over 25 dollars you get Free shipping. I bought two bottles since my wife and I take 1 10000 Iu pill each night.



http://pureformulas.com/ultra-k2-15-mg-90-softgels-by-complementary-prescri ptions.html

http://www.drugstore.com/healthy-origins-vitamin-d3-10000-iu-softgels/qxp33 5117?catid=183152

Be well,

t2t


Relentless Brand:
This is a pharmaceutical grade K2 Menatetrenone that you can purchase with confidence.
Bottled in FDA licensed, cGMP certified facility.
View Certificates of Analysis
90 Vegetarian Capsules
SUPPLEMENT FACTS
Expiration: May 2014
Serving size: 1 Capsule
%DRI
Menatetrenone (MK-4)... 15 mg 12500%
Other ingredients: Magnesium Stearate.
Capsule: vegetable (hydroxypropylmethylcellulose).

http://relentlessimprovement.com/catalog/vitamin-k2-menatetrenone.htm

• By bellavida
• Reply 3384247 · In reply to 3383041 by lilypads
• September 17, 2012 at 9:59 pm
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lilypads, you said "According to the book "Vitamin K2 and the Calcium Paradox," tests will soon be available that will let us know if we are getting enough K2. Then we won't be stuck with guesswork or the one-size-fits-all 45-mg daily."

Is this the test that Lara said she would find out when it would be available? If so, can you contact her to find out if she has an update?

• By lilypads
• Reply 3384492
• September 17, 2012 at 11:54 pm
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Bellavida, the test I was referring to is apparently available now in some places, but is pricey--it's the test for undercarboxylated osteocalcin (ucOC). On this test, the lower the score, the better. The author of "Vitamin K2 and the Calcium Paradox" says, on p. 166: "We should probably be striving for a value below 1.6 ng/ml." I'll check to see if Lara knows more.

T2T, how do you know that 1-2 mg of MK4 is sufficient? The author of the book mentioned above does not seem to know.

• By lilypads
• Reply 3384525
• September 18, 2012 at 12:16 am
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Bellavida, Life Extension offers a test for osteocalcin. You could call them and ask if the results can tell you if you are Vitamin K2 deficient. http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/ItemLC010249/Osteocalcin-Frozen-Tes t-Blood-Test.html

• By torn2tears
• Reply 3385500
• September 18, 2012 at 11:11 am
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Lillypads,

My wife has been taking 1.5 milligrams of K2-mk4 three times a day with a teaspoon of olive oil for over a year now.

In all the years that she has taken the bone density test she has been losing bone by .3% to .5% each and every year.

Despite getting STEROID shots each and every month for a knee injury for 2011, her most recent bone density
test back at the beginning of this year showed she had grown new bone by .7%

Just two MILLIgrams of K2-mk4 makes my sinuses open up in an incredible way for a great night’s sleep.

And it makes my gums and teeth feel smooth as silk.

Also just two MILLIgrams of K2 mk4 increases my libido in a profound way too.

100 MICROgrams of K2 mk7 does absolutely nothing for me, period; that I can tell.

My wife and i also take 10000 IU's of D3 at night only and we spray several shots of magnesium oil on our arms or legs in the mornings.

t2t

• By torn2tears
• Reply 3385717
• September 18, 2012 at 12:34 pm
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@ lillypads,

note: that I said 1 to two MILLIgrams of K2 mk4 "three" times a day...

• By bellavida
• Reply 3385759 · In reply to 3385717 by torn2tears
• September 18, 2012 at 12:50 pm
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I tend to agree with T2T's regimen. I use the Thorne liquid K2-MK4 drops and started out taking a total of 15mg/daily in divided doses spread throughout the day. I felt it working. But more recently, I've been re-thinking the amount of fat soluble vitamins I'm taking. So I reduced the dosage to a total of about 5mg/daily and the effect seems to be the same.

Lilypads, you seem to have a "rockstar constitution"! But I find with all the supplements I'm taking that I experience different side effects and esp with fat soluble vitamins, I think it's better to exercise caution. p.s. thanks for the info on the K2 testing :)

• By littlebitnhou
• Reply 3385894
• September 18, 2012 at 1:48 pm
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I have a question. Are there results with ALL these supplements minus Strontium Citrate? It seems this K2 really gets some top billing. (:

• By torn2tears
• Reply 3386114
• September 18, 2012 at 3:10 pm
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hi littlebitnhou,

Yes this is minus Strotum citrate...

I do paint 200 to 300 MILIgrams of iodine on my wife's skin which equates to about 25 to 35 MILLIgrams of iodine a day. She also takes 60 MILLIgrams of Armour thyroid a day. (she chews the Armour first before swallowing,) She lost over 30 lbs just on the 10000 D3 and almost 5 MILLIgrams of K2 mk4 too.
She has lost several more lbs since starting the Armour. Her daily body temperature was 96.2 each and everyday. It is 98.4 now. Body Temperature dictates whether my family takes Armour or not.
The iodine caused her TSH level to go from 5.4 to less than 1.40 in eight weeks.
She takes 200 MICROgrams of SeMC selenium everyday to protect the thyroid while taking the maintenance dose 25 to 45 mg's of IODINE.

Good wishes. always

t2t

• By lilypads
• Reply 3386140
• September 18, 2012 at 3:25 pm
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Bellavida, I don't have a rockstar constitution. In fact, I am supersensitive and have had many health problems throughout my life. That's how I got interested in studying these things. I was diagnosed with lupus in 2005, and had to take prednisone for a year. That's why I had my first Dexa scan. When "osteopenia" showed up, the doc urged me to take Fosamax. I said no, and did some research online. I found Dr. Wright's article about strontium, and decided to give it a try.

I also studied the Life Extension protocol for lupus and pretty much followed that. Life Extension recommends DHEA both for lupus and for osteoporosis. So I started taking that, and I still do. I also found an herbal treatment for lupus, kalawalla. I was better in 5 days. I still take half a dose of that, 7 years later.

Recently I have had no problems with fat-soluble vitamins, but some years back I stopped taking Vit. E as D-alpha tocopherol because I felt it interfered with my hormones. Recently, I tried Swanson's "Hair Skin & Nails" formula as a way of getting silica, but it gave me a weird feeling and a pounding heart. And MK7 interfered with my sleep. It's been trial and error all the way.

• By lilypads
• Reply 3387070
• September 18, 2012 at 9:29 pm
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Bellavida, here's your answer:

I believe the only lab currently providing the unOC test to docs and the
public is Metametrix -- here's a link:
http://www.metametrix.com/test-menu/profiles/vitamins/vitamin-k
The test is pricey -- we wanted to include it among a battery of tests we
are running for a Washington DC client group, and it was so expensive, they
decided to forego it. I expect as more labs offer unOC (and possibly unMGP
as well) we will see the price driven down by competition.
Re LEF test -- I could not figure out what they are testing. If it is the
sum of all osteocalcin in serum this would include both unOC and carboxylated
OC -- so this test would tell you little about your vit K2 needs. I expect
we could call in and ask them to specify what they are testing.

• By torn2tears
• Reply 3396929
• September 22, 2012 at 11:13 am
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Hi littlebitnhou,

Here in this thread lillypads pointed out that youwould have to take "6" capsules to get the 45 mg's of K2 mk4 from Osteo-K.

http://www.inspire.com/groups/national-osteoporosis-foundation/discussion/v it-k-as-mk4-prevents-fractures-by-stimulating-collagen-production/?page=2

Although I get the Ulta K2 mk4 I still buy the Carlsons 5 mg's caps for my wife. She opens the cap and divides it into 3 parts.

She takes the teaspoon of olive olive 3 times a day too.

Although I really like the magnesium oil I think the magnesium Malate pills (they are huge and you have to take three to get the full amount) I write about it in lillypads thread where she talked a little on the Osteo-K.

I have absolutely no association with any supplement I post.

Amazon has a good deal on the Magnesium malate and the Carlsons K2.

t2t

• By Nancy08
• Reply 3397725
• September 22, 2012 at 5:14 pm
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I take Osteo K and I have no side effects. I am pleased with it. I have taken 6 capsules a day as it is recommended, now I only take 3 a day and 5.000 i.u of D3. I take Osteo k in the evening and I take Osteo Mins in the morning, which has all the bone making minerals plus strontium.