Research studies on natural treatments for dysplasia?

• By Sophie-1977
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 1:22 pm
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Ashbar,

Unfortunately I only know of a study that's ongoing, so the results aren't in. It involves oral green tea ingestion and it's being conducted in Arizona, but they're in the recruitment phase. Results may take a long time to emerge:

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00303823

Sophie

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• By corellin
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 1:54 pm
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Hi Ashbar,

Unfortunately, I don't know of many studies on clearance of dysplasia due to natural products, but.... there sure are studies on clearance of CIN2/CIN3 when there has been no intervention whatsoever. CIN2/CIN3 can regress on its own, whether you saw a naturopath or changed your lifestyle or not.

Here's a link to an abstract entitled, "Cervical intraepithelial neoplasia grade 3 lesions can regress"

I'm not able to attach a link to the full article, but can e-mail you a copy if you send me your e-mail via a friend request. You might print it out to show to your GYN. It has a great graph that shows length of time between punch biopsy (the type of biopsy we get with our colpo) and cone procedure. The longer the time, the greater the percentage of CIN3 lesions that had regressed to CIN1 or less by the time a woman had the cone procedure. When the cone was 8.9 to 21 weeks after the initial biopsy, nearly 40% of CIN3 lesions had regressed to CIN1 or lower.

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=19900874

Here's a quote from the article that's not in the abstract:

"Although it may be difficult for some gynaecologists to accept an increase in the biopsy-cone interval to obtain the highest regression rates (used as they are to perform cone excisions as quickly as possible), it should be remembered that there is a long average interval between high-grade cervical lesions
(CIN2–3) and microinvasive cancer of many years – not a convincing argument for very rapid cone excision. Moreover, the increased regression rates with increasing follow-up (duration of biopsy-cone interval) should also be reassuring."

I would also like to add that your pap diagnosis of HGSIL without biopsy confirmation doesn't mean much. HSIL includes CIN2 or CIN3. So let's say the HSIL meant a CIN2 lesion. Well, CIN2 isn't considered pre-cancer by some experts who say it's not that "reproducible" and treatment is suggested only as an "insurance policy." I had my CIN2 treated because I had two spots in two different quadrants plus two spots of CINI in two other quadrants. I felt the lesions were too wide-spread to leave and because I'd been followed a year and it was only getting worse. But... the colposcopy after my first pap showed mild inflammation/ascus and GYN said everything looked good. It then escalated from there (11 months from ascus to four quadrants covered), and I've been wondering whether the frequent pap smears actually spread the HPV to new parts of the cervix. I still have regrets about the procedure and don't know whether it was the right thing to do . I also had persistent HPV16 which is the most aggressive HPV type. I felt I just didn't know what to do and because I was older, chose the procedure, not realizing how much of my cervix would be removed and how invasive a procedure it would be. Hindsight is not 20/20, because you can never know the road not taken.

I do want to say that colposcopies are not even very accurate and miss high grade (CIN2/CIN3 lesions) up to 30-50% of the time (according to one presenter at the International Papillomavirus conference). It's possible my "ascus" colpo was not true ascus because something was missed. Cells higher up in the cervix can also be missed on a colpo. Because of the lack of accuracy in all our tests, it's really a type-specific HPV test where you test repeatedly positive over time that is the best indicator of risk, because it's persistent infection with the same type that, over time, can lead to cancer in some cases. And, some types are more aggressive than others, so it's helpful to know the type.

I think we need and deserve to have as much information as possible to make decisions about our health. It's a big deal to decide whether to have a cervix-altering procedure or not. In my view, if we were to have type specific HPV tests, from sexual debut forward, we could keep track of our HPV infections and know how long we'd had them. Then if they persist for a long time > 2 or 3 years, only then would I consider a procedure, if it was a very aggressive HPV type and if there was some other indication that the cervix wasn't healthy. A procedure does very often cause clearance of the active HPV infection (because it surgically removes the cells that contain the HPV in the transformation zone), so in a way, the procedure does remove the source of the problem. Of course, there may be HPV-infected cells outside the excised area, but these are often in places that are less likely to cause a problem, which is why the majority of people begin testing negative for HPV after a LEEP procedure. I would be concerned about leaving an active high risk HPV infection for too long, regardless of the results of pap smears or colposcopies.

Ashbar -- best of luck to you in gathering the information you need to make the best decision for your health.

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• By ashbar
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 2:51 pm
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Thank you corellin! I knew you would have some good info! It sounds like we're on more or less the same page with natural vs. invasive treatments. Here's a little history:

Feb 2007-ASCUS pap, negative biopsy, high risk HPV
2 follow-up paps @ approx 6 & 12 months, both negative
Nov 2008-HGSIL pap, CIN 1 biopsy (Dec 08); refused LEEP
Feb 2009-HGSIL pap, started natural treatments with ND
June 2009-ASCUS pap, HPV still active

My gyn insists that despite the ASCUS pap in June, the dysplasia is getting worse (because it hasn't gone away completely & because she doesn't believe that the cells can revert back that quickly) & the abnormal cells need to be removed. She said even if she does another colpo, biopsy, & pap and the results are all NEGATIVE she would still recommend excision. Frankly, I could draw her a timeline of what was going on in my life that lines up perfectly with the changes in my cervix. I had high grade paps at the most stressed & unhealthy periods & ASCUS or negative at the least stressed/unhealthy times. Not to mention that the recent change back to ASCUS happened specifically during the period when I've been using all the supplements, eating better, not drinking, etc. But it's not her teaching to look at the body holistically, only to treat the presenting symptom. And she could be right...it's certainly an educated risk I'm taking, but it's not as if I'm ignoring the situation or doing nothing at all.

Despite the fact that we disagree on the interpretation of the results, she was very kind & did not resort to scare tactics to try to force me into a procedure (unlike other doctors I've encountered). She asked for my personal feelings & jusitifcation, and then asked what I want to do. I asked for another colposcopy/biopsy/ECC & a strain-type test (so I know if I have one of the more aggressive strains, in which case I will get the surgery). She said she's never heard of a strain-type test but she said she'll try to find one for me (I told her about Cervista & Amplicor), we scheduled a colpo for July, & she even said she would send off all the old pap samples to be reexamined in case something was over (or under) analyzed. I think she's trying to prove me wrong, but either way I end up with the information I need to make an informed decision. : )

Thanks for the article. I will definitely print & show it to her!

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• By corellin
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 3:14 pm
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Hi Ashbar -- Sounds like you do have a really supportive (in her own way) GYN. I hope that your tissue continues to improve and that your HPV becomes negative. Since you have had the high risk HPV for over two years, I think it's good that you're getting a type-specific test and that if it doesn't eventually clear, you plan to follow up more aggressively. I'm for holding out as long as possible, but given the inaccuracy of our tests, just wouldn't want to allow the active HPV to be around forever, since it can be an indication of dysplasia that's not being detected by the pap or colposcopy.
Good luck with your protocol!

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• By jamiegirl
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 5:12 pm
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ashbar - I had posted this link to a study a while ago regarding bee propolis/aloe vera and hpv:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17177657

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• By brieaukirsch
• Posted June 25, 2009 at 10:28 pm
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Corellin, thank you for posting these studies and especially for sharing your information from the hpv conference to back up your points. You say everything that's on my mind so much more cohesively and clearly. I want to print a stack of your replies for my gyn--for her EDUCATION!

Ashbar, I have read a lot of women successfully treating or managing dysplasia using Tori Hudson's protocol, which includes massive doses of vitamins and vaginal suppositories. If you have trouble finding the exact recommended protocol for each grade of dysplasia, send me a pm and I'll try to find the link for you. I believe Corellin said that her sister used that too, plus escharotic treatment (exfoliative therapy) and it helped the dysplasia but didn't result in clearance. I do (grudgingly) think conventional treatment is most effective but it depends on individual situation and the presence or absence of other health factors. More often the naturopathic protocol prevents the dysplasia from advancing or slows its advancement, more efficiently than it allows for clearance of hpv. At least that is my take. I think I would have had higher grade CIN without the naturopathic treatment as my hpv was very persistent spanning three quadrants and the endocervix, and I had open lesions on my cervix from hsv2 creating new entry points for the hpv.

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• By corellin
• Posted June 26, 2009 at 3:13 pm
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As you pointed out, brieaukirsch, each person's situation is different, and we all know our body best -- so the best we can do is gather as much information as possible and then make the best choice we can based on what we know.

One thing, though -- cancer is so prevalent that it's estimated about 1/2 of people in the U.S. will eventually die from some type of cancer. So even if naturopathic means don't necessarily prevent us from needing conventional treatment for dysplasia, at least we know we're reducing our odds of getting some other cancer (by generally improving our health). Of course, we have to die of something eventually, so maybe improving our health then increases the odds that we will die in an elevator accident (just kidding!).

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• By Curing_CIN3_onmyown
• Posted August 4, 2009 at 12:03 pm
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I cured my condition on my own! I had Cin3 and CIS - no more! :) Good luck to you - anyone can do this - its a matter of choice.

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• By ashbar
• Posted August 6, 2009 at 10:40 am
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Curing-How do you know for sure that you don't have CIN 3/CIS anymore? I ask because after 6 months of trying to beat this naturally (primarily through supplements & diet), I had an ASCUS pap, which I thought was a good sign. My doctor disagreed so we did a colpo & the biopsies came back CIN 3. My last biopsy in Dec 08 was only CIN 1 (with HGSIL paps in Nov 08 & Feb 09). So I don't even know what diagnostic device or practitioner to trust??

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