vitamin C

Anybody know anything about mega doses of Vit C given IV. Once my tumor is gone, I'm thinking about doing it once a week for maintenance. I was going to start it earlier but radiation onc told me to wait until tx was done. I have 2 more rounds of chemo before I get my pet scan in June. I've been to see 2 natural path dr's who encouraged me to do the Vit C. Thank you Nancy from Montana

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Nancy,
Several years ago, I did know someone who was doing mega doses of Vit C given through IV. I am sorry to say that she is no longer with us. She was not a member of this forum but she occasionally did post to cancergrace.org.

I believe that she did this for about 6 months while she was on Tarceva. After my experience with Tarceva, I could not understand how she managed to get out into the sun, and above all, ingest all that vitamin C without any skin rash. Unfortunately, she did not keep in touch with me as much as I would have liked, and then she was gone.

I don't know anyone else that has done the IV Vit C.
Hugs and prayers,
Marylou ♥

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According to the following phase 1 study, you can get as much as 1,500 mg/kg body weight (that is 75,000 mg, or 75 grams of ascorbic acid, for someone weighs 50 kg, or 110 lb) without side effect. Efficacy wise, I have seen good evidences that injecting pharmacologic doses of vitC can cure or arrest cancer in mice. But then we people at the lab have cured implanted or 'xenografted' cancer in mice many times.


Ann Oncol. 2008 Nov;19(11):1969-74.
...
PATIENTS AND METHODS: Patients with advanced cancer or hematologic malignancy were assigned to sequential cohorts infused with 0.4, 0.6, 0.9 and 1.5 g ascorbic acid/kg body weight three times weekly. RESULTS: Adverse events and toxicity were minimal at all dose levels. No patient had an objective anticancer response. CONCLUSIONS: High-dose i.v. ascorbic acid was well tolerated but failed to demonstrate anticancer activity when administered to patients with previously treated advanced malignancies.

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My dad has started taking high dosages of Vitamin C.
He has lung cancer.
He has a spot in both is upper and lower remaining lung and lung lining cancer in the side of the entire lung they removed (he was diagnosed in January 2011).
In 2007 they removed the top left lung and in 2009 the bottom left lung (had come back in 2009).
Not much the medical profession can do for him and we did not want to go the traditional route with Chemo. They could not assure us that it would work and we were not about to try to see if it would (didn't like the odds).
He is seeing a Naturepath.
He goes twice a week. He needs at least 1 day in between sessions to rest.
They started him at 60 g/session for a couple of sessions and he tolorated it well.
Then when they jumped to 100 g (since he has small veins the needle went out of his vein and caused swelling). They went back down to 80 g the next session and he tolorated that well.
He is now on his third week where they will be doing Nebulized glutathione for 2 sessions to give his arm a rest and then go back to 3 week sessions with the Vitamin C IV.
The goal is to eventually get him to 100 g /session twice a week.
He also takes 1,000 mg oral Vitamin C - 3 times a day on days he does not do the Vitamin C IV.
We are hoping to see an improvement in his next CT-Scan in a couple of months.
They have added Vitamin B complex to give him more energy which is working.

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The glutathione is interesting to me also. Is this a breathing treatment? Nancy





the

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High Dose IV Vit. C, properly administered, can be another very effective weapon in some cancer patients' arsenals. (This protocol can work well as a cytotoxic (cancer-killing) therapy without toxic side effects for the patient, but only if administered at the proper doses and for the proper amounts of time.)

Needless to say, it’s not a universal cure for every type of cancer and for every patient. It works particularly well for certain cancer cell types (i.e., those relatively deficient in the antioxidant enzyme catalase). And it must be done properly by an expert who knows what he/she’s doing.

Like everything cancer-related, it’s not “quick & easy.”

It is important to spend the necessary time to do in depth research for every protocol a patient is contemplating, and to get proper expert help. (And not make quick decisions based on cursory anecdotal evidence, or based on opinions offered by people who themselves never bothered to spend the necessary time to do in-depth research.)

Some starters for research:

I. www.oasisofhope.com

High dose IV Vit. C is a component of some of the protocols offered by the Oasis of Hope hospital in Mexico.

The goal is to induce oxidative stress in the tumors by employing intravenous infusion of a particular form of vitamin C (sodium ascorbate), sometimes supplemented with Vitamin K3 (menadione), so as to generate hydrogen peroxide in the tumor. This approach has the potential to kill cancer cells selectively while healthy cells remain unharmed, and works well for a number of cancers that are relatively deficient in the antioxidant enzyme catalase.

Specific scientific information, taken verbatim from the above Oasis of Hope website [many citations omitted]:

"... A high proportion of cancers have low activity of the enzyme catalase, which degrades the oxidant chemical hydrogen peroxide. This adaptation may be beneficial to the cancer.

Although oxidant chemicals can be toxic to cells, moderate increases in oxidant stress aid the growth and survival of many cancers. However, low catalase makes cancers potentially vulnerable to attack with hydrogen peroxide.

Recently, researchers at the National Institutes of Health have discovered that high concentrations of vitamin C (ascorbate) can react spontaneously with molecular oxygen within tumors to generate large amounts of hydrogen peroxide, which can be lethal to tumor cells whose catalase activity is low (8,9).

Such large concentrations can only be achieved by high dose intravenous infusions of vitamin C. Oral administration is ineffective in this regard (10).

These findings rationalize several previous case reports of objective tumor regression in cancer patients treated repeatedly with high-dose intravenous vitamin C (11-13). Vitamin C is not toxic to normal healthy tissues because they have ample amounts of catalase activity. The current protocol insures that blood and tissue levels of vitamin C will remain high, with millimolar levels close to those of blood sugar for at least 4 hours.

Selected References:

8. Chen Q, Espey MG, Krishna MC, Mitchell JB, Corpe CP, Buettner GR, Shacter E,
Levine M. Pharmacologic ascorbic acid concentrations selectively kill cancer cells:
action as a pro-drug to deliver hydrogen peroxide to tissues. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA
2005September20;102(38):13604-9.

9. Chen Q, Espey MG, Sun AY, Lee JH, Krishna MC, Shacter E, Choyke PL, Pooput
C, Kirk KL, Buettner GR, Levine M. Ascorbate in pharmacologic concentrations
selectively generates ascorbate radical and hydrogen peroxide in extracellular fluid in
vivo. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 2007 May 22;104(21):8749-54.

10. Padayatty SJ, Sun H, Wang Y, Riordan HD, Hewitt SM, Katz A, Wesley RA, Levine
M. Vitamin C pharmacokinetics: implications for oral and intravenous use. Ann Intern
Med 2004,April6;140(7):533-7.

11. Padayatty SJ, Levine M. Reevaluation of ascorbate in cancer treatment: emerging
evidence, open minds and serendipity. J Am Coll Nutr 2000 August;19(4):423-5.

12. Riordan HD, Casciari JJ, Gonzalez MJ, Riordan NH, Miranda-Massari JR, Taylor
P, Jackson JA. A pilot clinical study of continuous intravenous ascorbate in terminal
cancer patients. P R Health Sci J 2005 December;24(4):269-76.

13. Padayatty SJ, Riordan HD, Hewitt SM, Katz A, Hoffer LJ, Levine M. Intravenously
administered vitamin C as cancer therapy: three cases. CMAJ 2006 March
28;174(7):937-42. "

II. One of the original research papers on Vit C & cancer, by Linus Pauling (twice recipient of Nobel prize)

Cameron, E; Pauling, L. “Supplemental ascorbate in the supportive treatment of cancer: Prolongation of survival times in terminal human cancer.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, USA. 1976 Oct.; 73(10):3685-3689.

III. Excerpt from Thomas Levy, M.D., ’s book “Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases and Toxins: Curing the Incurable”
Benefits of I.V. Vitamin C

"... While researching thousands of articles over the last few years in the preparation of my latest book on vitamin C (Levy, 2002), interesting patterns began to emerge. Even though the effects of vitamin C on over 25 different infectious diseases and over 100 different toxins were examined, common mechanisms of action became apparent. This was especially significant ... since I had long wondered how a single chemical entity (ascorbate, or vitamin C) could have such dramatically positive clinical effects on such a wide array of completely unrelated chemical compounds and infectious agents. …

Dr. Albert Szent-Gyorgyi, the brilliant scientist who won the Nobel Prize in 1937 for his discovery of vitamin C, … asserted that energy exchange in the body can only occur when there is an imbalance of electrons among different molecules, assuring that electron flow must take place. Natural electron donators give up electrons to natural electron acceptors.

Szent-Gyorgyi maintained that dead tissue had a full complement of electrons, a state in which no further exchange or flow of electrons could take place. Another way of viewing this is that brisk electron flow and interchange equals health, impaired or poor electron flow and interchange equals disease, and cessation of flow and interchange equals death. Vitamin C, as the premier antioxidant in the body, is perhaps the most important ongoing electron donor to keep this electron flow at optimal levels.

Oxidation involves the loss of electrons, and an antioxidant counters this process by supplying electrons. Although vitamin C is the most important antioxidant in the body, there are many different antioxidants present in the body, and many of them work to keep the more important antioxidant substances in the body in the reduced state, which allows the donation of electrons. … Vitamin C, which is water soluble, helps to recharge oxidized vitamin E in those cell membranes back to the electron-rich reduced form. Even though vitamin C is not the primary antioxidant in the cell wall, it plays a vital role in maintaining the optimal levels of the metabolically active antioxidant, vitamin E, at that site.

It appears, then, that the local loss of electrons (oxidation) represents the primary degeneration, or metabolic breakdown, of the tissue or chemical substance losing the electrons. An antioxidant can serve to immediately restore this loss of electrons, resulting in a prompt "repair" of that acutely oxidized tissue. Also, an antioxidant can often neutralize the oxidizing agent before it gets a chance to oxidize, or damage, the tissue initially.

I.V. Vitamin C
… One conclusion that can be reached from this information is simple, elegant, and very compelling: All toxins poison by oxidizing enzymes and tissues.

There is also a compelling conclusion generated by this observation and supported by the vitamin C studies found in the scientific literature: All toxic damage can be repaired by a high enough dose of antioxidants. Of course, such therapy must be given in a timely fashion, before irreversible clinical consequences have occurred in the poisoned subject.

… Chronic disease can be viewed as a process in which the oxidative stress proceeds at a much slower pace than is seen with acute infectious diseases and acute toxin exposures. Vigorous antioxidant therapy goes a long way in reversing the clinical manifestations of such diseases as well, as long as the dose administered supplies enough electrons on a daily basis to reverse the ongoing oxidative damage from the disease process.


• … vitamin C is remarkably free of any side effects. Vitamin C is unquestionably the most non-toxic nutrient and supplement that is available today.

• An enormous amount of scientific literature on vitamin C has been written over the last century. Over 1,200 medical and scientific journal articles, many from our most esteemed research centers, have been cited in this book.

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Pinetrees, Thank you so much for the information. Its a little overwhelming all at once. I have a pet scan the end of June and hope to be in remission. Thats when I visit my Naturopath and build up my immune system to stop cancer from coming back. I just want to be as knowledgable as possible before I see her. Nancy from Montana

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Nancy,
Yes the amount of available information out there can be overwhelming.

So sometimes it's worth paying $$ to consult an expert.

One naturopath that was highly recommended from many sources, and who seemed extremely knowledgeable about high dose vitamin C, is Dr. Daniel Rubin, based in AZ.

www.naturopathicspecialists.com

I consulted him once. He highly recommended High Dose Vit. C in our case, even offering to help find doctors competent in Vit C admin in our area. Although I didn't follow up on his offer (because of the cost of consulting him - $ 375/hr; one can't do everything ...), and found a doctor on my own, he could be one option, if you are seriously interested in Vit C.

Best of luck,
Pinetrees

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thank you so much

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Yes it is. The medication is inhaled through the mouth/nose.

My dad said it tasted/smelled a bit like onions :)

This gave him a break as well from the Vit C IV. He has very small veins and last week the needle went out of the vein and his arm swelled. His naturepath uses the butterfly needle which is smaller but it still went out of his arm. One session she used a butterfly but with smallest needle but that took 2 hrs for the session vs. 1 hr.

For those of you who don't know about the butterfly needle I recommend that you keep it in mind. I found out about it once while we were in emergency with my dad and the nurse took some blood with it. I had never seen the contraption needle and asked what it was and why it was used. Over the last 4 years in hospitals and doctors it's amazing what you pick up.

Also when he goes for CT-Scans or blood work and there is needles involved the first thing I do is indicate that he has small veins and I indicate that if they are not too famililar with dealing with small veins to get someone who is. I try to be polite but don't really care I care more about my dad and his having to endure pain.

I once had it out with a male nurse where I simply ordered him to stop and get someone else. He had poked him at least 4 times and he had just had gone through major surgery.

It is exhausting dealing with nurses/doctors/etc. They seem to think that you will just accepted what they sahy and do. Patients are too emotional or just physically can't fight so someone else has to do it for them. I have sympathy for all of you out there and your love ones - I know what you are all going through and my prayers are with you. This is a great forum. I wish I had found it years ago.

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